The pair have been banging each other's heads together in text posts for ages sat down for "face-to-fate" chat in Brian Gathy's Liminal Currents vblog to see if they could sort matters out, and much to Watcher of the Dawn's surprise they did.
The conversation focused on a recent outpouring of the pair which followed the Charlie Kirk assassination, both of their reactions, and those of their followers. Most of it appears to be a break down in communication after Baker posted“Alea iacta est” [the die is cast]. When asked if he was really calling for civil war, he snapped back: “it had already started.”
Anti-fascist Italian writer Visconti sparked a storm after accusing broadcaster Baker of echoing far-right rhetoric when he used the phrase Alea iacta est. He argued that in Rome, where he grew up, fascists never openly call themselves fascists and instead rely on Latin dog whistles like Caesar’s famous declaration.
Visconti said that Baker’s history of giving airtime to figures such as Mark Stavish, along with comments from Baker’s followers that seemed to flirt with fantasies of right-wing violence, pushed him to call it out.
Baker rejected the claim that he was dabbling in extremism. He said he had used the phrase because he felt like Caesar crossing a threshold and that it was about a personal shift, not a rallying cry. “It was not a call to violence or civil war,” he insisted.
Baker felt that Visconti had misrepresented his stance on several issues. “I don’t know anything about Charlie Kirk. What I was responding to was more the murder of a Ukrainian woman 25 minutes from where I live… It might be that the man who killed her is not fit to stand trial, but more that the system allowed him onto the streets despite all his history.”
He stressed that politics is not his interest and that when guests veer into ideology, he tends to let them speak without challenge. “I think 80 per cent of the time I only agree with about 60 per cent of what they want to say,” Baker said.
Both admitted common ground. “We both know that we are not living in a Golden Age, and I see the Promethean spark in him,” Visconti said. He admitted that this was the first time they had spoken directly. “Maybe if we had done so sooner none of this sort of thing would have happened,” he said.
Visconti acknowledged that he could be overly reactive and was trying to work on that. He remained wary of far-right infiltration of the occult scene, which he said was as corrosive as the “Woke” wave that hit it a decade ago. He told Baker. “I do not see you as a Far Right lunatic. Maybe there is a way we can work together to get things back to the centre.”
One thing the pair agreed on seemed to be regular video meetings between occult speakers and "personalities" to prevent things becoming faceless text battles on social media so that views could be safely expressed and defused.
Basically while the world goes to hell in a handbag, occultists should be trying to be a bit more balanced in their dealings with each other and not be drawn into the divisions.
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